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Subject: Ministry Opportunity
Hey Richard! Hows married life with Tara and yourself? Its coming up to a year now...wow! I have sent a video to you concerning Teen Challenge Korea. The reason I am contacting you is in regards to this years youth summer camp that I am involved in as TC Korea's Canadian representative. Currently, I am co-ordinating the possibility of putting together a Canadian Team as special guests. I am aware that you have been working at TC Lambeth for a time (George Glover would be aware of Jonathan Aird and TC Korea, as well as myself) and that you also do spray painting as a ministry. I would like to offer you the opportunity to be on the Canadian Team for this years 2 wk international youth summer camp (in Korea) and use your ministry for Kids across the world. If you would like to know more, please contact me! We would love to have you as part of the team!
Sincerely,Natalie Steele
14 comments:
Hey Natalie,
Things are going really well. Tara and I are doing good, married life is really awesome. It's great to hear about you working with TC korea.
i've been here at TC for about a year and I'm having alot of fun here. I would love to know more about the proposed international youth summer camp. Like how much will it cost, where we would be staying, the days it falls on, what the ages of the kids are, and what my role would be while I'm there. Thank you for thinking of me, it's an honor that you would want me to come. I'm looking forward to hearing back from you.
-Richard Phillips aka Battle
Hey Richard,
This is quite perfect that you have already worked for TC! You know exactly what its about. And perhaps there is a chance that you could propose to George Glover to provide some time off as well as some support, considering that you would be participating on the whole with Global TC! I'm sure it would be plausible for him to work with you. Your expenses would be $1500 ($1100 max for plane fare, $400 spending money..which is A LOT) tops per person. You would be provided accommodation. Send me your e-mail and I send you an official invite with the details.
Blessings,
Natalie Steele
Hi Natalie,
My email is battle36@gmail.com I'm praying about it and talking it over with Tara. Tara is really excited and so am I by the possibility but I haven't heard anything from God yet and nothing is sticking out to me. Tara and I will continue to pray about this and seek His will in this situation. I encourage you to pray about whether we should be coming as well, Thank you.
Visiting South Korea would be a great experience, as my family can attest. And this is about as cheap as you can make a foreign trip like this since they'll take care of food/lodging once you're there. The impact you could have on the guys there could be enormous as well, you certainly have a unique ministry to offer.
My only caveat is that seems like such old-school thinking. Asking someone to pay their own way in order to do ministry? I supported my brother when he did this with YWAM, so I know it can be effective. And I did it myself when I did a two-week missions trip to Belize. Still, it seems to be asking for a lot of your resources: money, vacation time, ministry time, paint supplies, etc.
If you go for it, I hope that you feel like it's worth it and that God does use you in specific and direct ways.
You're right Jamie someone else should pay for it, and I'm glad you volunteered. Thanks again.
I agree with you Jamie that if I asked for somebody to come from Korea because they were a great Dance Dance revolution player and I thought it would be cool for the kids in the youth group I ran to see a world class DDR'er I would expect to flip the bill for him to come over. And if the cost was too much for the ministry value to the ends that I could not pay for it (me being the person most likely to see the fruits) than I certainly wouldn't suggest him or anybody else pay for it. That's like a stock broker saying "I wouldn't invest in it if it was my money but I think you should"
But that's not how the church works and you of all people know it. Our compacity for ministry isn't dependant on others following the good example of the philippian church (4:15) it is dependant on our obediance to the gospel not thiers. So I agree with you but, it doesn't change anything. We must be the change we wish to see and all that.
That being said I've already been blessed by God with a great job that does exactly that. I'm very greatful for it and I'm greatful for people like Ray from YFC and Bobby from Kalamazoo who have wanted to support me while ministering to thier flock.
Hey Richard, got your email and I will see about getting spray paint from over here. Just for your information Jamie I have seen people invited to Korea and everything paid for and in the aftermath of everything... well lets just say there were high expectations with very little output. Now is that the sponsoring ministries fault I don't think so. You may want to remember that Paul worked with his hands so he wasn't a burden to anyone. By the way I would like to add if I could I would and Natalie Steele can testify to that as she knows the sacrifices my family make.
If someone feels the Lord calling them to go somewhere He will provide. This where the challenge lays - do we trust in another to pay the way or do we trust in God to open the way ahead? I mean as a missionary, with a family of 5 to support (that includes my wife), I do what I do and help others in the process. But the moment someone says that is old skool thinking, I am like yep it is because the moment someone looks for the money the lose sight of the ministry as the drive becomes money orientated than people orientated.
By the way that doesn't mean I defer responsibility on my part as I am looking to support as many as I can when they get over here. Food, housing and travel and other expenses will be covered.
Richard, i will email you soon with the ideas I have got and would love to hear what God has placed on your heart.
Peace, Jonathan A. Missionary pioneer and Founder of TC Korea
Hello Richard,
Its great to see your passion on display. As you know, God has laid Korea on my heart and I am earnestly training as a missionary with others who will pioneer great firsts. I have sacrificed much to do missions and be a part of ministry - I don't regret it one bit. In ways that ministry doesn't always work out the way WE think it should, God always has His plans- its not a matter of ministry credibility.
We look forward to taking you through the process. I am praying for you and Tara as you do so. Keep on being faithful and don't lose your boldness.
Many Blessings,
Natalie Steele
Jonathan,
You made a point about Paul working for a living while he was a missionary. That's exactly what I am advocating. No offense intended with my "old school" comments, I guess I like Paul's even-more-old-school example. ;)
I'm a big fan of the idea of working *while* doing missions and not asking others for financial support. In the case of overseas trips like this, that could also mean having a job that pays well enough to make these trips once in a while.
My family has done missions to a fair extent, both supported and self-sufficient. My dad and I supported my brother in Hawaii YWAM for several years; my sister traveled with an evangelist through Canada and the US as their nanny; my parents worked in South Korea teaching English for several years, leading a small group. My dad supported our family while pastoring in Northern Ontario for very little money, similar to what you're doing. We've also done the short-term missions trips, like Richard is doing. We've done all kinds of variations on this theme, which is very cool.
As you pointed out, each approach has it's own advantages and disadvantages, right? I was only advocating a discussion of the pros and cons this time 'round...
wow I'm breaking a record on number of blog comments, lol.
Money is the root of all sorts of evil amen? That is why it shouldn't have anything to do with ministry amen? God has given me a job that by north american standards is very low paying but that's not the truth of the siuation because I'm one of the richest 10% of the world. The money God has given to me I have endeavoured to be responcible with, which is why I can afford to support two canadians going to korea on a short term missions trip (us). It is also because of that responcibility when I have not heard from God in a specific situation that I should seek his will in each situation and weigh out what is the best use of Gods money.
I've been reading "revolution in world misions" by KP Yohannan Founder of Gospel for Asia recently. I assume you (Natalie and John) would disagree with alot of what he says.
but i digress one day God will call me to account of what I did with what he gave me, I know I'm not supposed to bury it in a field somewhere but, I should invest it, amen? And as you've stated John "very little output" in missionaries, some would question if two english speaking canadians going to korea not knowing a word of korean, could they do enough "ministry output" to make the $3000 price tag justifiable. This is the question I was asking myself about myself and the answer I initially though of was: No. As a mentor of mine (threat) said (and I'm paraphrasing): "If your ministry is just about painting walls with a message, you've failed. Your interaction with people is the most important part of your ministry." So if I'm not interacting with people (because I don't speak the language) what is my ministry? The answer like I said in my email... (That I will post as the next topic) a friend of mine said he felt from the Lord that I should go. So that ends that discussion.
I have had the privilege of being in ministry for a while now and have had the experience of someone asking me to paint a skatepark telling me that they would pay me for it, later telling me that they did not have the funds to do so but they would still like me to come out anyways. I go to the place and they have $80,000 for the new skatepark they are building and currently have an $800,000 building fund. Steak for dinner etc. This is an organization that doesn't have $200 to pay me. I think the steak (only for the staff btw) was a pour use of ministry money.
I have herd it said from organizers (Rayski) in the same respect but in reffering to thier own minstry "This is where the challenge lays - do we trust in another to pay the way or do we trust in God to open the way ahead?" They suggest that to have the ministers/artists pay for it would be "asking annother to pay the way" and they have determined that they would not go on ahead and put on an event unless God opened a way they could pay for it.
John I fear i may have been too unsensitive. I would like to differentiate between the discussion that we are having about the philosophy of western ministry and the big difference between your eastern missionary work. I am really just questioning the validity of my work I dont mean to question your "ministry credibility".
I'll tell you something about me. I don't tip anybody who makes more money than I do. The other day I was at a hair dresser and she gave me a substandard cut and my wife asks right in front of the lady "are you going to tip her?" I had to of course at that point. Even though I know she rushed my cut and she makes alot more money caring for peoples vanity than I do stopping people from doing drugs. It just seems wrong to me. In the same way it doesn't sit right with me to accept money from someone who is poorer than I am. I think this is the case here. In India annother asain country the average person had 383,308 SKW a year to spend. Please don't tip me. Between me and my wife we made around 42,584,039 SKW last year. We have no debts and minimal expenses.
SKW=South Korean Won(s)
"Money is the root of all sorts of evil amen?"
Amen!
"That is why it shouldn't have anything to do with ministry amen?"
Um, what?
You mean, other than Bible passages like: John 16:9, 1 John 3:16, Acts 20:32, 2 Thess. 3:7, Luke 19:22, Like 16:9...
Hee hee. You made that statement, and then spent quite a bit of time explaining how you use money to support your ministry. Money has plenty to do with ministry. It just depends on how we want to deal with it and use it. Amen?
Ummm I couuldn't find Like 16:9 lol I'd "like" to refrase what I said. ahem, ahem...
"That is why it shouldn't have anything to do with whether or not we minister amen?"
but your right it can have alot to do with the type of ministry we do but not whether or not we minister.
"like" you never make mistakes Jamie lol.
Touche, good sir, touche!
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